Episode 137. Seeing Jesus As Friend with Wendy Pope

Unedited Transcript

Wendy. I am so thrilled to finally get to sit down and talk to you. I'm so excited about your book coming out, and I just want to welcome you to the show. Well, thank you for having me today, Rebecca. I appreciate that. This is so fun. I really excited about your new message called Jesus everlasting. We got to talk for a few minutes before we hit record.

Just about how much this matters so much to each of our lives and how much, um, even you. As the author of this book, you are living out this message in such a real way in your life right now, which I think. I don't know. I love hearing those God stories of how God does that. Even through the midst of suffering and hard times, which we're all, we're all doing battle with right now, um, in our own different flavors of that, but who Jesus is to us in our lives matters the reminding ourselves of those truths, that matters so much.

And so I want to hear, like, where did, where did this idea come from? That's so funny because, um, when I first started, well, the first book that the Lord gave me was wait and see. And, um, it was a message that I spoke about, um, called what to do in the white. And as I started writing more messages, the messages that I wrote ended up being.

My books. I don't know if that's how it ends up being with a lot of other Christian authors and speakers. But, um, you know, I never really, when I started speaking, I wasn't going to be a writer, an author, but God just does something. He does different things then you think you're going to be doing. Um, and so, uh, I wrote the wait and see, and then, um, Had the other, uh, other couple other books.

And I got to this fourth book and I remember, um, having a conversation with the Lord about, um, the deadline that I really needed to submit something for publication, you know? Um, are you watching the calendar Lord? We've got to turn something in and I did not have, um, an idea. For the book. And, um, I was washing my face one day and I don't know how you are with the Lord.

I really I've learned is to be so patient with him. Um, and. I put it out there, my prayers out there. And then I try my best just to go on about my life and come back and pray again. But I try not to harp on it. I really try not to harp on it. Um, and just out of the blue, I was washing my face and I looked up and the Lord was like, you know, that Christmas message.

Yes, sir. I do know that Christmas message it's called the gift goes on. That's your book. Um, and it was an accidental message. Um, at Proverbs 31, when I was speaking with them, they would have. Um, they wanted us to develop, um, occasional messages, like a mother's day message or a Christmas or an Easter. So when we, or call them, like on an occasion, we would have a message ready, and I'm not an occasion.

Speaker. I want to have whatever the Lord's putting on my heart real and raw, fresh, right then. So I'm not one of those ones that do this, but that's what they wanted. And so I began praying, and this is what came out, this Isaiah nine, six, uh, the gift goes on. And so I probably put this message together. 15 years ago.

And so, um, I washed my face. Like I said, I was having this moment with the Lord and I was like, gosh, it's really good. So I went and got my computer and I started writing things out. And as. The book began to develop. It began to take on a life that I had not taught about. I started studying five different women who encountered Jesus as the wonderful counselor, mighty God, everlasting father, and the prince of peace.

So, um, the beauty of the book Rebecca, is that we, we study that great. Prophetic word from Isaiah that we probably all have on some kind of plaques that we hang up at Christmas and we tie it to the new Testament and who Jesus is to us because we fall under the gift of that prophecy through our salvation in Jesus Christ.

So it was the first time I've ever written about women. I've had a lot of people say to me, you know, why are you only writing about men, David and Moses? And. Paul. And he's like, well, I just, you know, I'm just writing what the Lord puts on my heart. So I love that I had the opportunity to study women in the Bible.

Um, and maybe not necessarily she women like Deborah or Esther, you know, these, she women that, that I am woman hear me war type thing. Cause I'm not that. I'm not that kind of women. I love being a woman. Don't get me wrong, but I'm not one of those. See women hear me war kind of thing. I love that I met these vulnerable women and I met them and study their interactions with Jesus and some of the most vulnerable times of their lives.

And we're able to unpack and see that he, um, he really is every day he is for us every single day. You know, we tend to leave him on the cross or maybe in the cradle at Christmas, but he is our every day savior. And so we get to see that beautifully with these women. And I'm, I'm truly excited about getting it out in everyone's hands to see that Jesus has.

Yeah. I think that gives so much freedom to women listening who are like, yeah, I don't have it all together. Yeah. I'm not the girl who finishes my to-do list every day. Yeah. I'm not the girl who got up at 5:00 AM and drank all the water and hustled my way through my Tuesday. Right. Like right. And this idea of Jesus walking with us every day is like the actual thing that we need right now in the midst of a bunch of books that are flying off the shelves at target that like, give us this maybe other message that is actually very worldly of like how to achieve success or how to pursue our calling, whatever, which is something that I'm really passionate about is changing that narrative.

And so for those very women, like why. Right now, do you think it's so important more than ever for women to know that Jesus is with them? Like why does that matter tests so much? Honestly, because there's so many things competing for Jesus in our lives. Right. There really is just like you said, this, that whole narrative that's out there of, and I just kind of touched on it as, you know, we've got to achieve this, we've got to do this and we're, you know, we can do it all.

We can have, you know, a perfect marriage and the perfect child and the perfect home and the perfect career and all that. There's so much competing with. The essence of who we are supposed to be and that his image bearers of Jesus Christ, which totally goes against what the world is telling us. The image bearer of Jesus Christ is humble is kind is loving is gentle.

Is patient is long suffering. It's that fruit of the spirit. Um, it's gentle. And, um, joyful and it's the total opposite of what the world is telling us. So there's this constant conflict with women and, um, I just, I'm not one of those women that get into that race. I don't want to, I don't want to go there.

I want to, I want to, um, I want to do surely everything that God is calling me to do and fulfill everything that he's placing in front of me and that he's, um, purposed me to do. Um, and that's for me. The first and foremost is to be an image bearer for Christ, but then, um, to be a husband, a wife, to my husband, to be a mother, to my children who are now adults to be caregiver for my, um, aging father.

And, um, those are the most important things. And I believe. When we get caught up as women, when we get caught up in the competition of those two worlds, um, we're, we're not happy. We're not satisfied. We aren't fulfilling that. The very essence of what we were created as women to be. And, um, and, uh, it, it creates a, it creates illusions that.

Of grand jury that we were never created to be part of. Um, so just that competition that's out there is, is fierce. It really is. And, um, I just, I was one of those women that loved being at home with my kids and playing in the water puddles and building mud pies and playing with Lego's and go into the library and, and all of those things.

Satan has lied to women. Really? Rebecca has lied to women to tell us that the way that God, what God birthed in us is not enough for us. And, um, so I want this book to be, um, just like an open door for women to go, oh minute, Jesus. Is enough for me. And then if, if there is more, cause I don't want to say that success and I'm certainly not saying that success and, and, um, well the recognition or however you want to package that is wrong, that's not wrong.

Um, it's wrong when it becomes our idol, when it becomes something that's in front of what God has originally called us to be, um, when it takes that fluff. Yeah. Um, so I think it, just to me, Jesus is just my friend and, uh, he's, he is my comforter. He's my defender. When, when I don't look like the world, I don't care that I don't look like the world.

Uh, I don't, uh, I'm standing on the truth of who he created me to be. And, um, that's my defense. I don't have to defend myself. Um, you know, and so I do hope that women see Jesus as more than a savior for a long time. That's what I lived for him. Lived him, lived as that. He was my savior, which he is, and, oh my goodness, if you did nothing else, but, but die for our sins, it would be enough.

But, um, that he is with us every day, um, is such a gift. Yeah, the gift that goes on as I've mentioned before. Yeah. That's so good. You know, windy, I recently changed the name of the podcast. Something else to our name now, which is called radical radiance. And God kept bringing me back to this passage in Psalm 34 it's first five that says those who look to him are radiant and their faces are never covered in shame.

God, for months just kept bringing me back to that. And then I'm reading through the Bible chronologically this year and. I just began asking God, like, show me throughout the pages of scripture, like where there's evidence of like us radiating the heart of Jesus. Like show me what that looks like. And so I'm reading through Exodus and, you know, Moses is coming off Mount Sinai and glowing the glory of God.

He in the presence of God for 40 days, I get to numbers and the Lord is instructing Moses on how to care for the lamps and the tabernacle, the tabernacle. Place where people experience the presence of God, those lands, where the actual light source of people experiencing the presence of God. But wait, now we have the holy spirit living inside of us, illuminating us to be able to walk forward into our lives and radiate the love of Christ.

And so I just began seeing it everywhere. And so. As you can tell I'm a little bit on fire about this. Like maybe it'll be a book one day who knows. I actually had a conversation with somebody the other day and I was like, I haven't actually started a book proposal for that yet. I have this thing where I have, if I have a book idea, I have like a, I have like a folder on my computer where I keep it.

Oh yeah. Proposal for each of my ideas. Right. And I haven't done it for this yet, but I probably need to, um, So I say all that to say, I have had several friends asked me to be on their podcast since I, I, I, I did the rebrand and have conversations about radiance and what it looks like. And I was on a zoom call the other day with a girl.

And this is, this is just what God's been doing in me this week. That kind of relates to what we're talking about. She was asking me questions. They were great questions about, okay, well, how do we. How do we be radiant? What does it look like? And so, so when she asked me, how do we be radiant? I just kind of stopped for a second.

And I was like, listen, I can give you a list of things to do, like read your Bible, walking community with other believers, develop a vibrant prayer life. Like I could, I could give you some stuff to do, but. The heart behind what I think this verse is saying in Psalm 34 is those who look to him are radiant.

Their faces are never covered in shame. We're radiant. When we abide in Christ, like I can give you all, I can give you the list of things, but if you want it to be radiant, abide in Jesus, look to him, the author and perfecter of our faith. And then what does it look like? Well, what it looks like as it, as it grows and builds in our lives is, is the fruits of the spirit.

Like you saying, the fruits of the spirit a minute ago reminded me of that. And it's like, yeah, that's, that's the evidence. That's not the checklist. That is the fruit that's produced in me as I abide God and Jesus, that happens naturally. Yeah. We don't make it happen. Yeah, it happens naturally. That's why you can't explain it.

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Okay. So this is, you can imagine why I was excited to talk to you about this book. And so, as I was reading, you know, over kind of the different parts about Jesus that you talk about. So he's our friend, he's our father, he's our defender, our counselor. I don't know why defender stood out to me.

So my, why do I do know why it stood out to me so much as I read the back cover of the book. And I think it's because we live in a culture. That is so defensive right now. And you spoke to this a little bit, but I'd love to just give you the floor to share whatever you want to share. We want people to go grab the book, but like, why is it so important for people to see Jesus as our defender rather than feeling like it's our obligation to like win every battle?

You know what I mean? Gosh, it's kind of like what you're talking about with radiance. It just happens. You know? I mean, I, I grew up, um, before I was really close to Christ just, and I call it the dance. I mean, I just feel like it's a tandem. It's just a beautiful, it's, it's a marriage dance that we have with Jesus every single day.

Um, I got to this place by reading the Bible every single day. It didn't happen overnight. I've been reading the Bible cover to cover chronologically for, um, I think this is my 13th year. Wow. And, um, it's an investment of my wife to the point where it's like, ha he's like second nature to me. He's he? And it's.

I don't. I just, I, like I said, it's, it's hard for me to put into words. I just don't feel like I owe anybody anything. Yeah. There's freedom there. And our world tells us, you have to explain yourself, you have to, um, you know, why did you put that up there on social media? Or why do you, you know, why do you, um, Why do you go to church on Sundays?

Why do you read your Bible every day? Why do you, why, why, why, why, why just. It's almost like the, the, the wonderful counselor, the mighty God, everlasting father, prince of peace. It's like, it's all one, all one, but yet he's all different. And he's, he's all in youth of the person of the holy spirit and right when you need whatever it is that you need, he's there to supply it.

And as far as the defender, I just, I've just gotten to the point where it's just like, it's just the end. Um, because here's the thing, everybody, everybody in your life, Rebecca, everybody is going to let you down. Every single person with skin is going to let you down. No matter how much your husband loves.

She kids love her. Your mama love you. Daddy love your best friend loves you. Same with me. And that's what I've discovered. Wow. That's painful. That's kinda negative. Wendy bummer. Yeah. Okay. It is a bummer because we don't want the people that we love the most to let us down. All right. But what happens, what has happened in my life is I realize that he will never let me down.

Ever ever, ever, he is always the one that's on the couch with me when I'm crying or in the car when I'm having a bad day. When that person that I love the most hurt me, knowing that he is right there with me, gives me the power to forgive. It gives me the power to love and to overlook, to, um, to accept things the way that they are.

I really don't even know that I've even explained it well, other than I just, I feel like I'm, I don't have to explain myself to anybody. I have, I'm answering to one person and one person alone, and there's so much freedom in that. Um, you know, it's like, so-and-so will say, well, Hey, did you see this movie?

Whatever. And you know, and I'm like, yeah, no, I don't, I don't really go see movies. Well, why I said, I just don't really like them. There's just not a lot of good stuff out there, but it's so good. And I'm like, yeah, but my father really doesn't like for me to it. To see those kind of movies or to go to those kinds of places, or I just like my daddy says, no, it's just not good for me.

And I've just learned to rest in that. And that's the piece that is everlasting. That's the, he's the prince of peace. And we can, we can live in this world that is in so, so much conflict with, they were supposed to be with great people. Um, because of, because of our relationship with him, but we have to, we have to invest in that relationship, went back there and it took me a lot, a lot of years to learn that.

I mean, I'm 54. Um, and it took me a lot of years to realize the investment. Um, we invest in a lot of things. Money time, um, energies, talents in a lot of different things to do well in a lot of different things that don't matter in the long run. Yeah. Um, we do. So the most important thing really is. I love that.

I get to teach. I love that I get to write books. Um, still don't understand why God chose me to do these things. Cause, um, I. I know that I disappoint him in so many ways, but ultimately you can have it all. You just don't take Jesus. Yeah. Yeah. And yeah, I'm going to go back to the whole, he's not going to let us down idea because it reminded me of a story that actually wrote something about the other day.

So it's fresh on my brain. You know that song king of my heart. I think he's the key of my heart, the mountain where I run. Oh yeah. The verses are just beautiful in that song. Well, I remember I married, my husband. I had been in kind of a really long season of singleness. All my friends were getting married.

I had been in nine weddings as a bridesmaid. I'd planned probably just as many. I think I was in 11. I had people are like starting to make the jokes about 27 dresses, all the things. Right. And, um, yeah. And I remember sitting in church one day, that song was new at that point in time. And you know, those moments when you say you're singing in a worship service, but then you realize like your heart doesn't believe anything that's coming out of your mouth.

If you're being gut-level on it. Right. Yeah. And so I remember getting to the bridge of that song over and over. It says you're never going to let me down and you're never going to let me down. And I just remember praying God like that doesn't feel true right now. Like it doesn't like, I, like, I do feel let down, I planned another one at party and bought a ton more laundry for somebody else last week.

Like, yeah. And like when his marriage going to be my turn and I was just really battling that. Something that my husband says a lot that I think really speaks well to, to somebody in that type of season, which is a lot of our listeners is like, if we knew everything that God knows, like if we, if we knew all the details, like we would choose his best for us.

Like we would choose a hundred times over, you know, But we, we are, unfortunately, not all knowing and, and like, we don't know what's happening behind the scenes and like just the idea that we can trust him. Like we can trust him as our friend. We can trust him as our counselor, as our father, even in those times where maybe we don't know all the things and maybe we feel let down, you know, like he meets us in your friend in that.

Well, and one of the things. That helped me get through those moments because I still have, those is as close as I am to him. And as much as I know of his faithfulness and have experienced it, there are still times when I'm like, what are you doing? Um, you know, I shared, you know, my mother passed away April 8th, uh, or we buried her April eight and, um, and my mother-in-law died July 4th.

This year. So you're like, what are you doing? You know, I don't get this. What are you doing? But in, um, I know I'm not alone. I'm sure there's a lot of people that are listening, going. Yeah, I get that. So how is he trustworthy? I, I like to, to call it a faithfulness bank and. Tuck away those times that he shows himself faithful to me.

So during the times, when it's hard for me to see him as a defender, when it's hard to see his counsel in front of me, I can go make a D a withdrawal. Um, and, and faithfulness for me comes through, um, my obedience in him. I think him most faithful in my life when I am most obedient. To him and his call on my life, whatever it might be, whether it's, you know, getting up and spending time every single morning and prayer with him, whether it's doing something for someone that I don't necessarily want to do, but he's called me to do it, whether it's, um, putting myself out there and really.

And laying something on the line. Um, whatever it is he asks us to do and I will step out in obedience or, or we step out in obedience. And he shows up that is an act of faithfulness and we can deposit that. So we can, when we're sitting in the uncertainty going, you know, uh, why am I planning another bottle shower?

Why am I sitting at another funeral? Why am I in the cancer ward again? Um, we can. Go wait a minute. Okay. I don't know the why to right now, but I know the hoop of the right now. And he has been faithful and these other times. Yeah. And he's going to not, not be faithful again because it would go against his character and he's not going to do that.

It might not work out in the manner of how we think it should. Um, Scripture is very clear that he makes our path straight. Um, the, the it's in Proverbs and an also in Isaiah. Um, and I just. I just like, all right, Lord. How are you going to make this straight? Yeah, I can't wait to see how you're going to work this out.

I don't know. I don't know how this is going to work out to my good to your glory, but I love you. I'm called according to your purpose. Um, and I don't see how this is going to work out, but your word says it's going to, and the bottom line is to Rebecca's. We don't get to define good DOD does. You know, the world will define good.

And we define good in the standard of the world. God's good is so much better than our definition of good. And guess I would want my mom to still be here with me, but she was suffering with liver cancer. So what I want her to come back Kevin's no, you know, her hands were crippled from years of fighting rheumatoid arthritis.

Would I want her to be here? Um, slipping away with, with dementia. Yeah. You know, so mark out the way I wanted it to work out, I prayed for her to be healed, but I know that she is healed and whole because she's with him. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and I have that, that confident assurance because of the daily investment that I've made in the relationship.

The Jesus that's with me every single day. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. You know, what gets me about God is the fact that he doesn't change. Like, you know, our friendship started like 39 minutes ago, but so what you don't know about me is I'm married my husband two years and a little bit ago, lived in Tennessee previously to that.

When I married him, it was, it was that thing, right. That I had prayed. And I just thought, God, for, for so many years, And then in the same moment that I said I do, I moved nine hours away from everything I've ever known. I became a pastor's wife. I started a new job. Everything about my life was flipped upside down in a good way.

Right. Like I got to experience the joys of marriage and doing ministry alongside somebody else. It was also the hardest year of my life, our first year. Yes. Yes. And. The thing that I stood on so many days was the fact that God does not change. He is immutable. And if he wasn't. All of these other things that we know to be true about him, his sovereignty, his wisdom, his faithfulness, all of those things.

Like I couldn't trust any of that either if he could change. So in the middle of a life that was flipped upside down, that was changing at a rate as rapid as it was like, I could stand on the fact that God was faithful and he would not ever change, you know? So. Yeah. So anyway, that's where I've been the last couple of years.

Um, well, I, I know you and I are both so passionate about scripture and you do something that I would love for you to tell our people about. You mentioned that you've been walking through the Bible chronologically for many, many years now, but that you have not done that alone. You have a whole community of people that do that with you alongside you.

I want you to tell people about. Yes. It is the most exciting thing in my life, other than my relationship with Jesus and my family. And that is being in the word every single day. Um, I did not, I do not have a degree in anything other than elementary education. Um, so I did not go to school to study the Bible.

Um, and, um, Rebecca Satan wants Satan wants God's children. To think that because we don't have a seminary degree or because we are not going to Bible college, that we can't understand the Bible and it is his goal to keep up. Um, believing that lie. Um, so just, I want to lay it out to encourage your listeners.

The only thing that you need to understand the Bible is a Bible and the holy spirit, that's it. It's that simple. It's that simple. Well, and then the third thing is, invest your time. So maybe there's three things. But I started reading the one year college go Bible. Um, in 2008, I read it for the very first time.

And, um, it literally changed my life. That new living translation is what I read because it's written on a sixth grade level for girls like me who have a hard time understanding and comprehending. Uh, I have to rethink over and over again. But it has literally changed my life. Um, I started a blog in 2009.

Just invited a few hundred people to three Proverbs, 31 ministries, uh, through a devotion that I wrote, Hey, you want to read with me? I'm going to be reading. And, um, LA 20, let's see, 2019 that blog through the Bible turned into a nonprofit ministry called word up ministries. Um, you can find us@wordupministries.org, and we have, um, daily video teaching.

Of the one year chronological Bible. So you are with a community of people that are all over the world. I can't, I don't even know. I can't even guess about how many people we've walked with through the Bible all over the world. Um, but it's, it's simple. You open your Bible, you read, you go to the website, you watch the TV.

And you share with this community of believers. Hey, I do not understand why you have to have a dove and you have to pull it apart. You have to do this, or why did God, um, have Alijah sit there until all of the water dried up? Or why did this happen and why did that happen? This is hard. Why would God send them into an all light, a whole people, group women and children.

Also, those things are hard. Yep. Those things are hard. And it's so great to process those with other people who also go, Hey, this is hard. Um, so it is, it is the complete joy of my life. And, um, it would be the joy of your life as well. Anyone that wants to just join us, we start the old tests, the new Testament.

September 24th. Awesome. Um, so it's a great time to pop on and start getting the feel of the class. Um, and, um, it there's, there's no right or wrong answers. It's the class is free. All you need is a Bible. Um, if you can't afford a Bible, we will send you one. Um, it's yeah, it's just. That's phenomenal. It really is Rebecca.

It really is. And you're reading it for the first time this year chronologically. Yeah, I'm going to be honest. And I have, this is an encouragement to somebody who's maybe walked down a similar path. I have tried probably most years of my life. I've been walking with Jesus since I was 10 years old. I was raised in an independent, fundamental Baptist church.

And that's just what you do. Yeah. Every year. Oh yeah. You read through your Bible cover to cover. And so I was. I, I love following rules. Um, yeah, it's easy to kind of fall into that for me, with my, with my walk, with the Lord. And so many years of my life, I have made it to, I've made it through Psalms. I've made it through first king, like first, second Kings a couple of times, but I always quit at some point.

I always get shiny object syndrome and I start something else and I never finish it. And I, um, I'm really excited to have a second. A second option to share with people because this year, maybe I'll go through yours next year. I'm going through terribly. Cobbles the Bible recap this year. I'm using her book that she, she did, um, that walks through chronologically.

So, I mean, I really, I, I think I'm going to make it, like, I think I'm actually going to finish it this time. I'm so well, what's so cool about the chronological Bible is that it is really in story form almost. Like Psalm 34 is right with David is running from solve and he is acting like a madman in front of king of gash, the king of the Philistines.

Um, it's right there. Psalm 51 is. After Nathan has confronted him about his sin with best Sheba Chronicles and Kings are all intertwined. So it's like you're reading multiple books of the Bible at the same time. It's almost like a mind game, um, because I'm one of those Czech girls too. Um, and so it really, um, all of your.

Profits are in with your Kings. They're not all separate. So you're reading, it's almost like you're reading the whole Bible at the same time and it's just, it's fascinating. It is fascinating. And I'm, I would never, I mean, I've said this and I'll say it until Jesus comes. I probably would never have read the Bible all the way through.

Had I not discovered the chronological. Yeah, because I would get to, I think Beth Moore called, called it, the graveyard of the old Testament is Leviticus. You get there and you die because it's so overwhelming. You don't understand it. And you, you have great intentions, but you just get, then you're thinking none of this matters.

Oh. But it does matter because you read all of that and you realize, oh, we have Jesus. We don't have to do any of. Yeah, look at what they had to do, but we don't because of Jesus. Yeah. I encourage your readers to pick up a copy. If you don't, if you need one, email me gut of our website, wind a word up ministries.org, or you can email me wendy@windypoked.org, and I'll send you.

That's awesome. It's the best thing that you can do for yourself is to get in the word of God every day. Yeah. Amen. I am just, I'm so proud of you for leading this, like this matter so much. And, um, I mean just the, the sticktuitiveness of like walking with people through the entire council scripture, like that matters, that matters so much.

And so, um, I'm excited to see what God continues to do through that. And I am so, so excited about your new book. I'm going to say the name of it. One more time for people who might not have caught it at the beginning, it's called Jesus everlasting. By the time this releases, it will be out in the world, which probably feels crazy to you, Wendy.

But you turn, you turn them in last year. I turned it in last year. It's like, oh, I need to refresh myself and read the book. Yeah, I know. Right. I know that has to feel so crazy. That's so awesome. Well, we, we are rooting for you and we're so excited as it really thank you world. Yeah, we were going to hop on over to our Patrion community now and get to know Wendy a little bit better over there, but for now, um, when the, I just want to say a big thank you for your time today.

I'm so grateful. Thank you for having me.